Intermediate Question How do you add in the following costs?

[PressureX]

So i've done quiet a few estimates, but I have never really looked into it exactly.

I have a pricing scheme, but nothing really on how to add in extras, like lets say ladder is needed, plants in the way etc.

How do you add that in (would be nice if you would tell me if you use quickbooks)

I mean I don't really want to insert an item called "ladder needed" or anything like that, which people can easily see ....

So my main question is, how do you add in:

If you have to use a ladder?
Special care around a lot of garden/plants right by the house?
Difficult to reach areas?

You can just send me a PM if you prefer.

Thank You everybody!

[MMI Enterprises]

How you can add such in is by firstly not commiting to price until job is seen. Then you simply up your rate by dividing what the extras would seem to equal in a dollar amount by the total footage. This gives you a cents or dollars figure to increase your standard by. So you make another inventory item or tiered pricing reflecting the increase in your quoting/bidding program. Before you know it you can just look at something and call it a dollar amount per foot or a total dollar amount. Time can be harder..least for me anyway.

[Beth n Rod]

If you are talking about a standard house wash, your x-jet should keep you on the ground most ( not all) of the time. For decks with no stairs, you are not going to have to place it too many times. We look at terrain and the number of ladder changes, and add accordingly for difficulty ( sorry - I know that sounds vague and it is). Just remember it takes time and physical effort to properly and safely place a ladder so as not to harm the worker or the property. Never be afraid to ask a client to trim a tree or bush before you work, since an improperly placed ladder can land you in the hospital or worse.

Beth

[Ron Musgraves]

That was my first thought, you mean everytime something gets a little tough you can ad on?

[MMI Enterprises]

Oh and if ya want to charge top dollar consider the idea of not going food shopping on empty stomach and apply same logic to bidding. Only bid something while tired and sore.

[Beth n Rod]

Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves

That was my first thought, you mean everytime something gets a little tough you can ad on?

For residential, yes. There are all sorts of challenges, terrain, plants, town homes are close proximity so you have to care for the neighbors area as well as the customer's area, you have to tote the ladder and hoses farther if it is in the middle of a row...and the list goes on.

Beth

[5 Star Johnny]

That was my first thought, you mean everytime something gets a little tough you can ad on?

I sense some cynicism here?! Sure, there is a certain amount of "extra" movement or work that's typical with any wash job, and may or may not be part of the "norm" for a particular contractor. Thus, they may not charge extra for that. I can only speak for our pricing structure. I take into account extreme or difficult grades & approaches to the structure which will slow me down. Heavily obstructed foliage areas, ladder work, equipment movement, etc. are also noted when I view the job. I have created seperate excel spreadsheets specific to the type of work we're bidding. Siding cleaning, flatwork and deck work. Dimensions are keyed in and the formulas figure out chems, labor, etc. If there are price add ons for ladder work, obstructions, etc., I estimate time involved and enter it as an added price. The customer never sees this, so it doesn't come up as an issue. I will, however, note the circumstance that is adding some additonal labor cost on our proposal, without actually disclosing the actual price impact. Works for us.

Time is money. If it's going to create extra time that is out of your ordinary bidding process, you gotta' charge for it.

[Beth n Rod]

Originally Posted by 5 Star Johnny

I sense some cynicism here?! Sure, there is a certain amount of "extra" movement or work that's typical with any wash job, and may or may not be part of the "norm" for a particular contractor. Thus, they may not charge extra for that. I can only speak for our pricing structure. I take into account extreme or difficult grades & approaches to the structure which will slow me down. Heavily obstructed foliage areas, ladder work, equipment movement, etc. are also noted when I view the job. I have created seperate excel spreadsheets specific to the type of work we're bidding. Siding cleaning, flatwork and deck work. Dimensions are keyed in and the formulas figure out chems, labor, etc. If there are price add ons for ladder work, obstructions, etc., I estimate time involved and enter it as an added price. The customer never sees this, so it doesn't come up as an issue. I will, however, note the circumstance that is adding some additonal labor cost on our proposal, without actually disclosing the actual price impact. Works for us.

Time is money. If it's going to create extra time that is out of your ordinary bidding process, you gotta' charge for it.

Exactly. I doubt anyone charges the same rate for every job. If your guys are spending an extra couple of hours on a job, of course you are going to charge accordingly. Or at least one would hope...

Beth

[PressurePros]

Originally Posted by Ron Musgraves

That was my first thought, you mean everytime something gets a little tough you can ad on?

Absolutely. Difficult terrain and height can add a couple of hours to a deck job. I would add 20% to my s/f labor pricing on that type of job to compensate. I have learned in residential when you give an inch, some may expect the mile. Even down to making sure the jobsite is free from obstruction my contract has a per item moving fee. If a guy is walking with a potted planter and trips and it breaks I have the cost to replace plus the time to cleanup the mess. If the person is elderly or we do a last minute squeeze in on a strip because rain is causing us to delay staining other projects, then I obviously forego that charge.

PressX, Kevin is right on the money. You will have to carefully calculate your times and what those additional obstructions and difficulties cost and break them down into your s/f pricing or express as a percentage of add-on.

[5 Star Johnny]

Even down to making sure the jobsite is free from obstruction my contract has a per item moving fee.

Ken, do you get much objection to this "moving fee"? I've thought of adding this to my proposals for those HO's that "forget" to clear the area. It obviously adds time, and liability if something gets broke. I am going to start putting a "disclaimer" in my proposals that states if we have to move something after sufficient notice that we were going to arrive, we are not responsible for damaged property. Last year one of my guys broke a glass top, patio end table and it cost me $95 to replace the glass & two trips to the glass store.

We also overlook the extra work in moving for elderly or "last minute" scheduling.

[PressureX]

I try to add in what additional time it takes, and then just increase my price in quickbooks for each additional job. So one job I might charge 0.055, and the next where i need to do "more" or use ladder etc. I might charge 0.075 .... thats how I have been doing it, but I was thinking maybe there is a way to do it more efficently.

[Cajun Cleanin]

I use a basic manhour charge I charge for every hour on the job and all the equipment is included.

If I'm there so is all my equipment whether I use it or not so I charge per hour for everything I do,on moving stuff its a different rate for the laborers but it is still a set rate based on what I see it taking as far as time.

I think you can make estimates so complicated that you are always second guessing yourself and trying to spend to much time to squeeze every penny out of a job you may or may not get.My .02 (based on time to write reply lol)

[MMI Enterprises]

As example of extra work going uncharged...Last gimmie I gave was helping an elderly put his frniture back on a pool deck. Fella had like 5 metal firepit chairs with cushions, a standard 6 chair table and umbrella setup with cushions, two chase lounge with umbrella, 5 bar chairs, a whicker rattan couch with two chairs cushions and foot table. There was more but I forget what.. garage was filled with stuff. Took as long just about to put the stuff back as it did to do job.

[Beth n Rod]

There is a little known formula used to take into account for life's unexpected time drainers...its called a 'P.I.T.A.' Factor. (Pain In The Arse) One can use them in percentage increments on a scale of 1-5. For example;
1=5% (minimal difficulty above normal)
2=10% (Terrain, plants, access)
3=15% (Difficult task or multiple ladder moves needed)
4=20% (Multiple ladder moves on sloped, terraced or steep terrain etc)
5=25% (Problematic customer, abusive or otherwise) JK on this one.

But you get the idea, you can come up with your own scale as you learn how these affect your job progress.

Rod!~

[PressurePros]

Originally Posted by 5 Star Johnny

Ken, do you get much objection to this "moving fee"? I've thought of adding this to my proposals for those HO's that "forget" to clear the area. It obviously adds time, and liability if something gets broke. I am going to start putting a "disclaimer" in my proposals that states if we have to move something after sufficient notice that we were going to arrive, we are not responsible for damaged property. Last year one of my guys broke a glass top, patio end table and it cost me $95 to replace the glass & two trips to the glass store.

We also overlook the extra work in moving for elderly or "last minute" scheduling.

John, never any problem. In your disclaimer cover both ends with a moving fee and release from liability. During my sales presentation I let customers know that there is a small fee for moving items ($1-$5 per item) BUT if we break anything that is not prearanged to be moved, we are not liable for repair or replacement. That has been enough to motivate most people to move their own items.

The only issue I can ever remember was a couple that said they were going to clear the deck and did not. They had 30 chairs, 3 tables and maybe ten Rubbermaid containers that were all waterlogged with wet clothes inside them. Add in this was a deck that was 70' long and had 14 steps. I billed them $75. They balked but paid it. I don't like causing people inconvenience but I had specifically discussed a $25 moving fee at the time of the contract signing and they didn't want to pay it. "Oh no we'll definitely have it all moved off." After the job was completed I got a call. "You didn't put our stuff back on the deck." (keep in mind wet stain) The job was out of the area and one I didn't really want to perform maintenance upon. I told them the return fee would be $200 as we were not a moving company and that project would eat up 1.5 hrs of our day. They hung up on me LOL. Next.