Sodium Hypochlorite

[Ronnie Reeves]

Im unable to find Sodium Hypochlorite in 12.5 solution here locally, but walmart has a bag of Calcium Hypochlorite which is 65% Chlorine, my question is whats the difference in Sodium Hypochlorite and Calcium Hypochlorite?

I have a local chemical dealer that sells Sodium Hypochlorite but sells it in a powder form, 100lb drum for 147.50 if I pick it up. He says I can mix it to a 12.5 solution and it will make aprox. 1200 gallons which is way more than I can use. My question here is can it be mixed from a powder in small amounts and be mixed at the same strength each time due to fillers in the powder? Thanks, Ronnie Reeves

[RyanH]

This essentially how I mix my solution.
I buy calcium hypochlorite in 100lbs quantities for $100 and mix it to the concentration I want. Roughly, the amounts are 1/4 cup per gallon of water yields a 1% solution. So for a 12% solution, you would mix 3 cups per gallon of water. The available chlorine may be different in sodium vs. calcium (almost definitely so due to the composition of each).
If I had a choice, I would go with the sodium over calcium as the sodium is more soluble in water and will be easier to wash off....I have a terrible problem with overspray unless I allow my solution to sit for quite awhile after mixing it.
But it does the job.

Ryan H.

[Ronnie Reeves]

Ryan, do you know the chlorine % in your Calcium Hypochlorite? Also have you ever tried this on asphalt shingles? Thanks, Ronnie

[RyanH]

I think it's around 97% available chlorine (somewhere in the 90's, but I'm pretty sure on that number). I have used it on asphalt shingles and it has worked rather well. The key is to spray it on liberally and rinse it off VERY well. I mix in a little dish or car wash detergent to give it some consistency so that the chemical will not run off the roof immediately upon application. It does require patience, however, and several applications to completely clean the roof.....resist the temptation to apply "just a little more pressure" and stick with the low pressure, high volume approach. I use the X-Jet when doing this. I attached a 50' hose to the X-jet and run both lines to the roof. If the roof is too high (over 1 story or you are parked low on a driveway, etc.), you may have to pump the chlorine into the hose to overcome the difference in height. A 12-volt sump pump or shurflo pump should be sufficient.

Ryan H.

[Ronnie Reeves]

I have a sure flow pump hooked to a 25 gallon tank on a cart that I may use for applying it to the roof. Do you let the solution dry on the roof before reapplying the second or third coat? Also do you use 12% or less on asphalt shingles? I have a x jet but was wondering if it would wash off with a water hose at high pressure? Thanks, Ronnie

[RyanH]

I mix the solution to be around 8% (I like cooking, which means I *hate* measuring stuff, so I put in an amount that looks appropriate) and then apply with an X-Jet so that my final solution actually going onto the roof is somewhere between 3 and 4%. If it is really bad I'll bump it up to around 6%, but that's rare (and rather dangerous and requires better clothing coverage). I don't like to let it dry completely because there is the problem of getting the dried calcium to completely rinse off. Just apply it often enough to keep it wet, and try to do one side at a time so you can control your timing.

If I had the time and motivation, I would like to make a batch of filtered cleaning solution at my house so I can put it in my truck and take it with me, as opposed to mixing it on location, which puts too much free calcium in my solution. But that's for another day.

You could definitely apply it with the shurflo pump, but 25 gal may not be enough to do an entire roof (on larger houses or commercial buildings, like churches or doctors' offices). If you want go this route, I would suggest prewetting the roof and then applying the chlorine, and you may want to make the solution a little stronger so that you only have to rinse it twice (or thrice, depending upon the severity). I like to rinse four or five times to make sure everything is removed.

A heavy rain can be your best friend with roof washing if you apply lots of cleaner a few hours before the storm.

Sorry if my answers seem a little erratic....I'm working on some projects and my brain is a little mixed up right now!!!! If you still have any questions, I'll give another try and hopefully by tonight I can be a little more coherent.
:sonic:
Ryan H.

[Paul B.]

One of the differences between sodium and potassium hypochlorite is the pH.
While sodium hypochlorite is in the range of pH 13-14, potassium hypochlorite is in the range of pH 7-8, making it ideal for pool water use. You end up using potassium hypochlorite to kill germs and algea and use a separate chemical (alkaline or acid) to increase or decrease you pH level to neutral.

I doubt very much that 100 lbs. will make 1200 gallons of 12.5% liquid solution. I believe Ryan's numbers are closer to reality (although it's tough to tell without titration), giving you 44-1/2 gallons, in which case it will cost you about $3.32 per gallon and your time mixing. (At $100 your cost is $2.25 per gallon.)

Mix it in a 55 gallon dark plastic container, then keep it out of the sun, heat and keep it capped all the time as air, sun and heat will decrease the shelf life
rapidly. Normal shelf life should be about 3-4 months from the time you mix it.

[CCPC]

Ryan, how do you apply a 3 or 4% amount of chlorine without damaging the sorounding vegitation?

[Ronnie Reeves]

Thanks for the information guys, Im in the process of trying to find some chemicals that work, I bought some house cleaning chemicals from a well known distributor and im going to toss it, I have better luck using Jomax from Home Depot and adding Bleach. Im finishing an aluminum roof tomorrow that I have had to wash twice, 3 times in some places, I sure will be glad to find the chemicals I need to do each job.

Thanks again for the information, Ronnie Reeves

[RyanH]

Okay, here is little more comprehensive method.
The chlorine I buy says that 6.25 lbs (100 oz) per 50 gallons will make a 1% solution.
1 oz. is roughly 2 tbsp (as given by the container) of this product.
So, 200 tbsp is 12.5 cups per 50 gallons for 1%.
To put it in better terms,
1/4 cup per gallon per % point (like I said in an earlier post, this is just validation from the literature).
Paul makes a good point about testing pH with titrations, and I might do that in the next week or so, I just need to find a standardized acid solution.

CCPC...Since the concentration is dependent upon how much water is mixed with the solution. I just spray down the vegetation with water first, apply my chemical, then spray the vegetation down again. I have gone back to the property several days after cleaning it to check on chemical burns and have found no evidence of it (except for the rare occasion when I'm too slow to turn the valve on the Xjet off and the solution is siphoned out before I can get to it, but that's neither more nor often). If there are many bushes or flowers that are too fragile to spray down directly with water, I'll cover it with light-weight plastic and wet the ground around it.

Ryan H.

[Ronnie Reeves]

Thanks for the information! Ronnie

[ParadiseProWash]

If you are having that much trouble finding it you can always use EFC-38 in your mix it is sodium percarbanate base. It works well I have used it when I ran out of Sodium Hypochlorite but it does take a little longer for it to work. Just a thought.

[Mike Williamson]

That's why I love the XJet M5...For fragile plants I just turn it to the wide spray pattern and stand back a ways.

[CompletelyClean]

Will sodium percarb damage vinyl siding? I read on the sodium percard wood cleaner that I use to be careful of surrounding surfaces, as it may damage some surfaces. What are "some surfaces"?

[Mike Williamson]

sodium percarbonate is basically oxyclean. It is the primary ingredient....I've never known it to damage anything.